Is it depression or laziness?

[Vermilion]

This is something I can't get my head around; some people get labelled as lazy while others get labelled as depressed.
Some people might spend all day in bed but they're lazy, I do it and it's called depression. Some people who don't maintain hygiene are lazy but others are depressed. Etc. Is it just that what we think of as laziness is actually depression? In which case shouldn't I just be able to kick myself up the arse and get on with it? How do I know the difference (assuming that is the case) between being depressed and being lazy?
 

[Rob]

Depressed people find it difficult to be self motivated through the condition. Lazy people just can't be assed. You really have to know the background of a person sometimes, but there's a much bigger picture to depression which 'lazy' people don't have.

[Vermilion]

Isn't laziness a lack of self motivation though? And a lack of self motivation would lead to depression in the sense that there'll be things you haven't achieved/regrets and the like.
 In life it's necessary to push yourself but I can't figure out if it's just laziness or depression in my case.
Maybe I'm overthinking again :/.

[Rob]

I can see how you're thinking. Not realising goals might be depressing, but I think that's more of a sadness than a debilitating depression. Laziness is just deliberately avoiding jobs/chores. You have motivation, ie you want things, but depression masks motivation to act.

[Lorien]

I think executive dysfunction has a role in the difference too. Sometime people want to be able to do something but cant organise their thoughts or motivation enough to do that, whether they are depressed or not.

I guess lazy has a range of connotations. Some people might think it is lazy to leave a plate on the lounge floor after eating. But in our house that is usually - it took so long to motivate yourself to eat what was on the plate, you now have nothing left to put it away. I think if I'm honest, most people have a reason for their "laziness" but it is often used as a descriptor of behaviour other people don't understand. I've been looking at mood scales a lot recently so sorry if this doesn't make a great deal of sense. If your mood is usually between 6 and 4 then the amount of effort it takes to do things is not usually demanding. You might not feel like a spring clean on a 4 day, but most things aren't so much effort. So it is difficult to understand why someone who has moods higher or lower on that scale might not be able to do the things you see as normal. If it takes all the effort you have to do 3 small task, your house and hygiene are not going to be squeaky clean. Similarly if you can only focus on one project remembering to eat is a bonus. It isn't lazy to not put the plate away...that detracts from the "ever so important project" you're working on.

It might be a bit off the point, but I don't know if there is really such thing as lazy. It is an evaluation of someone else's priorities and actions. I'm not sure we ever have a full enough picture of the thought process to evaluate something fairly.

[Vermilion]

That's certainly a new way to look at it, the part about the mood scales makes a lot of sense. The conclusion seems to be that 'laziness' is relative and perhaps considering the extra effort it can take to organise thoughts and also dealing with the physical fatigue while having extra daily struggles means that I'm not necessarily 'lazy' .
Perhaps the term 'lazy' is just society's way of passing judgement on others; I'd say that everyone finds life difficult and perhaps people get frustrated at others who aren't capable of doing as much. We've all read the tirade against 'lazy shirkers' on benefits' in The Daily Fail and the like, they don't know that for us it's not leisure time but merely trying to get though the day without hurting ourselves.
I think that I really need to talk this through with psych, if I can stop beating my self up (literally and figuratively) that would be a step in the right direction.
Another problem is trying to distinguish between intense sadness which everyone has sometimes and a more debilitating depression. Many people conflate the two I think. I'm going to hurt my psych's brain with stuff  but I really need to understand these things.

Thanks both.

[Terri]

For me, depression is physical as well as mental. It's heavy weight on my body as well as crushing nothingness, not even sadness. It's different for different people, I think.


I hear you about the idleness thing. I don't know. I try hard not to be, but today I am in clothes that I've worn for the past three days, I haven't showered and I've sent most of the day under a duvet on the sofa. My Mum had to drive me to McDonalds to get a wrap or I wouldn't have eaten anything. I don't even feel demotivated. I feel paralysed. Is that a thing? I'm not depressed at the moment, but I am incredibly anious. I find the aniety more debiliatating than the depression. I get 'stuck.' You know?


Daily Fail. Ugh.

[Vermilion]

Yeah, depression does has it's physical side, I've sometimes described it as like living with a permanent flu with the aching and tiredness. I think for me anxiety exacerbates it because I get frustrated with myself, then I get depressed because I can't do things, then I get anxious because I can't do things, it's hard to get out of that.
Emotions are exhausting, even 'normal' people feel tired after an emotional event but we feel these intense emotions constantly so it's no wonder we struggle with everyday life.
I'm starting to understand a little more now.

[Lorien]

Maybe it's worth applying the flu analogy further? GPS have describedthe difference between flu a bad cold with "if someone offered you thousands of pounds and all you had to do was go outside, someone with flu wouldn't. Someone with a bad cold probably could"

If the motivator was high enough, someone "being lazy" would attempt the goal, but you could offer me anything on some times and I still wouldn't be up to moving. Unless you've felt that, maybe you don't have the insight into how hard that can be, hence the daily fail tirade.

Maybe in terms of not beating yourself up - you could consider how much effort it would be to do something and what the motivator would need to be to achieve it.

Perspective is an odd thing.

[Vermilion]

The OT said something similar earlier about the motivation side, you summed it up well . It's tricky for me to get my head around because there isn't really a solid definition or an obvious line between laziness and the depression and at what point have I pushed myself enough. I'm understanding slowly but hating myself for so many years is going to take some time to change.

One thing is certain- people need to stop getting they're info from the gutter press and then judging people on it. It adds fuel to the fire of self hatred.